Speaker 1:
0:00
Today we have a special, another special guest. Is that what we say every time when we open up to this podcast?
Speaker 2:
0:06
Yeah well, everyone we have is special, so it's not like we're lying.
Speaker 1:
0:10
Yes. So if you heard that little, that's us throwing confetti in the metaverse, because we celebrate everybody that comes and is a guest here at Killer B Studios or is in the live audience, and we're always excited to see new people come who joined us this week. Meta Olivia, now hold on, I need to practice saying your name correctly. All right, I got teased by everybody, including yourself and my wife. I don't say your name, right? So, meta Olivia, would you please share who was our special guest this week? How's that?
Speaker 2:
0:38
Well, great job. We have CCM, which stands for Contemporary Christian Music. Artist Lydia Laird.
Speaker 1:
0:50
So Lydia shared her personal story of struggling with mental health and I'll tell you, I have to say I was pretty, pretty impressed with with her moves out here because when we introduced when we introduced Lydia, she jumped right over the top of the couch right in the show.
Speaker 2:
1:07
Yeah, she was pretty impressive, I must say yes. And how about her outfit? Uh huh, yep.
Speaker 1:
1:16
Sure, all right, people might be listening. That was not her fault.
Speaker 2:
1:19
That was not her fault. That was Brian's fault.
Speaker 1:
1:22
So usually what happens is I create the avatars for all the guests that are joining us, and this was the first girl avatar I had to create and I didn't know what to put her in, so I chose this flowery dress. She made it very clear that that was not her style.
Speaker 2:
1:40
No, no offense to 80 year old women, but you made her look like an 80 year old.
Speaker 1:
1:47
So moving forward, that will be Meta Olivia's job. Moving forward. Hey, see that I said your name right again. So yeah, so, yeah. Well, our next guest that we joined us will be Jason Gray, and Jason Gray, I've already got him all decked out on his avatar Leather jacket, some skinny jeans, even though you don't have legs in here. But how they could be impressed, we'll see, We'll see. All right With that, let's go and jump in Like we talk about meta age, because people get the headset and they're like OK, I just got to get in there and try to figure it out. So she's only in the meta age of like 10, 15 minutes probably, totally.
Speaker 3:
2:17
So don't put my hands because I don't know what I'm doing.
Speaker 2:
2:20
No one does, even if you've been in here for a while.
Speaker 1:
2:24
And she's a huge fan of flowers. There is, and she's a huge fan of flowers. She loves flowers. That's why she's got this flower.
Speaker 3:
2:31
No. First of all, flowers are great, but this is not who I would have dressed myself. Thanks, Brian.
Speaker 1:
2:40
So I, like I'm like I'm going to leave that up to Meta Olivia and moving forward, Like you get the girls avatars right. He's all handed the guys. But, Lydia, we're so happy to have you join us. We really are Real quickly, as we get ready to get started, can you take about 30 seconds and just tell everybody a little bit about yourself and who you are?
Speaker 3:
3:01
Sure, so hi, my name is Lydia I obviously he said we're in Nashville, tennessee, right now. I am a Christian songwriter and artist here. I also do music for other genres and sync as well. But a big part of my story and my testimony is talking about mental health and kind of giving a safe space for others who may have maybe even grown up in the church Like I have, but didn't always feel like they could talk about that or be honest about that struggle. So that's a really big passion of mine and I'm excited to talk about that a little bit tonight.
Speaker 1:
3:32
Yeah, and we're excited to have you come share, because I think that is something that we kind of. We kind of hide that stuff and bury it. How did you know when you, when you got to the point that you realize that you needed to reach out to someone?
Speaker 3:
3:42
Um, I, I'll try to think. I don't know the exact time. I mean growing up, I I'm one of 10 kids. I grew up in an incredible Christian home 10 kids. You may not have known that you got a whole story here, right here.
Speaker 2:
3:56
Yeah, I know when are you.
Speaker 3:
3:58
I'm literally in the line I'm number seven. So there's three boys, seven girls.
Speaker 1:
4:04
Yeah, OK, so OK does anybody here have? More than more than those of you guys. Just family have more than 10 kids. I would like to know that.
Speaker 3:
4:11
There's no way.
Speaker 1:
4:12
No, absolutely no how many people here have scissors? How many do scissors have? Let's see, I'm going to go here because I don't think we can hear, so I'm going to go here and see what she says. How many.
Speaker 4:
4:23
Mike was up, my grandmother had 18 kids whoa, her grandmother had 18 kids, 18.
Speaker 2:
4:33
That's insane, that's crazy.
Speaker 1:
4:39
My gosh. Well, thank you for sharing that. While 18 kids, that that's yeah, all right.
Speaker 3:
4:46
Okay, fine, you beat me, whatever. I grew up in an incredible Christian home. My dad was a pastor, we were missionaries and Romania for a couple years, like since I could walk and talk, I was hearing about Jesus, and so when I struggled with Panic attacks in middle school and then as I continued to growing up anxiety, depression I always thought that maybe it was just something wrong with me and my faith.
Speaker 3:
5:19
And then it wasn't until my early 20s that I started going to counseling and I realized, no, it's not about me not praying enough for being in the word enough Sometimes, because we live in a broken world and we can get sick. Our brains Sometimes can use extra help too, and it's not a very black and white Thing where you can just do a one-size-fits-all. You know there's a lot that goes into mental health and mental illness and situational things, physical things, medical, spiritual. But realizing that it's okay to talk about it and be honest about it and even use the tools that God's given us is A very freeing thing. Because growing up I I didn't always let myself feel free. I almost felt shame. And the more you realize wait, god's not a God of shame, the more you are set free to go oh, I can just figure this out, I can use tools and and there's no condemnation that I battle these things- how did you first start realizing that maybe there was something else going on?
Speaker 3:
6:14
I was. I was 22 at the time and I was had just moved to Nashville and was pursuing music. I was away from my family for the first time and I I deal with pretty seasonal depression. So when it starts to get cold or dark or whatever, I oftentimes will find myself getting very depressed, low energy, that kind of thing. And I remember going drawing my best to deal with it only spiritually. I was praying, I was in the word.
Speaker 3:
6:39
I felt like such a failure as a Christian because I thought why am I still battling depression if I'm a Christian, am I just a bad Christian? And then I remember going to a doctor. I was going to counseling, but I went to a doctor friend of mine and I just cried to her and I said you know, her name was Jerry. And I said Jerry. And I I don't understand, like why, as a believer, do I battle this? And she said, honey, sometimes our brain just needs a little extra help, and that's okay.
Speaker 3:
7:04
We live in a broken world and it affects a lot of different aspects and I think sometimes we almost, you know, we can be very performance based as Christians and even though we Subconsciously, like we, believe we're saved by grace through faith.
Speaker 3:
7:16
Right, it's none of ourselves.
Speaker 3:
7:18
We still are kind of trying to earn it and trying to make sure we are good Christian and, and I think we have a lot of fear attached to sometimes using tools that God actually is not saying we can't use.
Speaker 3:
7:30
So for me it was counseling. It was Talking to my oldest brother. He took me on a fishing trip once and was like, hey, just so you know, I've never told you, but I've battled depression for years and I've been taking medication and like hearing that he took medication, it was like, oh my gosh, you mean, it's not a sin to get help from a doctor. So I think it was. It was a journey for me. It was a journey for me and I think through a lot of that, the Lord just taught me that a lot of my lack of freedom to To, to try different things and to be open about this kind of was directly correlated to my Misunderstanding of the gospel that the gospel sets free, it doesn't condemn, it doesn't shame you, and that God loves you and he's with you in it and he doesn't want you to walk through these battles alone.
Speaker 1:
8:11
Hmm, that's good.
Speaker 2:
8:12
That's really good, lydia so I know that you started talking about going to counseling, but what led you up to actually Realizing like, hey, I really need to get into counseling. Like what got you to that?
Speaker 3:
8:27
point. I'm honestly not a hundred percent sure. I think I think it was. It was after I moved to Nashville, so I was away from my family and I I think I was just having experiencing so many things for the first time and trying to really Ground myself. And you know, in my family didn't? We didn't really talk much about depression or mental health things, and Quite a few people in my family have battled Even. There have even been a few people who had suicide attempts, and but it's always. You know, it's not that my parents are incredible people, but it's one of those things it's uncomfortable to always talk about.
Speaker 3:
9:00
You know, and and I think, when I moved to Nashville and I'm, you know, fearing all these things out by myself, I remember hitting a point where, at the time, I was a part-time nanny and I would play with the kids all day and I would leave the house with such an empty, depressed feeling. I just felt hopeless and I thought something's not right. Like something is just not right. I have to get help, and I'm not. I think it may have been my oldest brother. I, he again, I went back to Texas so depressed and feeling so ashamed that something was wrong with me that I was depressed as a Christian. And he took me fishing and he said you know, lid? He said I feel like you're just living in this very Performance-based view of God's love for you, like you think that you have to not be depressed, you have to be happy, you have to, you know all these things right.
Speaker 3:
9:43
And he said I'm gonna, I'm gonna give you a statement and you tell me if it's true or not. And he said I am worthless without Jesus. And I said, well, yeah, of course you know that's true. He said well, what about this? I am worthy because of Jesus. And I said, well, yeah, that's true too.
Speaker 3:
9:57
And he said okay, well, where are you putting your emphasis really matters if we're constantly living in the fact that I'm never enough Versus oh, because of Jesus, I am more than a conqueror, I am free, and not only that, but Jesus gives me freedom to seek out tools and help. He knows this world's hard like that kind of gave me freedom. And then, and then hearing my own brother, who I admire so much, who's a worship pastor in Texas, say I'm in counseling, it made me go. Oh, you are. So I can go like I'm not a messed up Christian if I go get help and I'm still in counseling today, guys, I think, I think we all need it if we can get it, you know, and we can also find it in commute, just community sometimes, but it's just so important to never walk through anything alone absolutely the.
Speaker 1:
10:44
What would you say to someone that's actually struggling and feeling embarrassed that might be Going through the same stuff like what would you? Would you say to somebody? I?
Speaker 3:
11:14
would say Something that my dad told me a long time ago. Once, when I just was dealing with a lot of shame, I went and just told my dad all this stuff I was struggling with and he said, honey, if you could see the skeletons in everybody's closet, you'd be amazed. The fact is, we all look at each other and we only see surface level oftentimes. But everybody's fighting a battle. We all know that quote. Like everyone's fighting a battle that you don't know that. So be kind to them, you know.
Speaker 4:
11:39
Yeah.
Speaker 3:
11:40
I think, that there's so much you know scripture talks about when you bring what's in the dark into the light. There's so much freedom. And now that's not to say we're all in different places in our journey, so not everybody's a safe person to go to with your struggle. Sadly, there was a time when I wasn't. I remember mentoring a young girl years and years ago, before I went to counseling myself, and she told me she was on anti-depressants and I wasn't free. And so I felt like, oh, that's a sin, which I laugh thinking that now because I'm on anti-depressants. But I remember telling her oh Well, you just need to be in the word more, you need to be praying more, all these things.
Speaker 3:
12:15
I wasn't a safe person for her because I wasn't in a place on my own journey where I had freedom. There I was living a very legalistic version of the gospel where I was afraid to To fail God and there's, we don't have to live like that, there's, there's no condemnation for us. So so I think if you're in that place, we're like, oh, I don't know who to go to. Well, you go to somebody, you go to a counselor, or you go to a pastor, or you go to somebody where you feel like this is a safe place and you just be honest, because the fact is, we all struggle and if we saw the worst of each other, we'd probably like, oh my gosh, you too, you know, see us.
Speaker 3:
12:47
Lewis, he's my favorite author and he says like friendship is born when you look at someone else and you go. You too. I thought I was the only one, and I think the fact is, with mental health, depression, anxiety, panic attacks, bipolar, all these things a lot of us battle with these things and we, just we. We think we're the only one. So Satan keeps us in private, but there's freedom when we come out into the light. So it's time to do that.
Speaker 1:
13:11
That's really powerful because it talks about in the scriptures like when we are weak, he is strong. It's being vulnerable to share that when you're open to come and talk about this. I was really excited about it because I do. I think in here in Horizons we've met a lot of people that have come up and been very open about the struggles they're going with. I feel like people feel like coming into the virtual world is a safe place because they're behind an avatar. They're a little bit more open and be vulnerable. But people are really building good relationships in here and people really care for each other. I'm so grateful for that.
Speaker 1:
13:47
How many people here is on social media? I would say that's probably one of the worst places for seeing only the highlights of people's lives. That's what we can very easily look at other people and say, man, if I could just be more like Lydia, if I could be more like Olivia, I would have it so much more together. We live that off of highlights. One of the things that we've been talking about and maybe you can give us some insight on this at Killer B is we're trying to process how do we leave digital better than we found it Because digital itself has become a huge what's the right word? A meta-livvy. It's fed the mental health issues that people have with depression, anxiety, comparison. What are some things that you would say we should do? We should be thinking about each one of us here when we approach these social media platforms. How can we approach it to leave it better than we found it?
Speaker 3:
14:47
I think, first of all, you have to deal with everything in your own sphere first. It's like for myself. I have to be responsible for my own intake and for my own, what I'm processing, comparing all these things before I can pour out to others. It's like anything God gave us food and it's wonderful, but in bad context, when you're overeating because you're depressed, it's not good for you anymore. I think social media and digital is very similar. These are great tools, especially. I love Jesus. I love sharing about the love of Jesus. For me, it's great. I want to tell everybody about him. This is a great opportunity for that.
Speaker 3:
15:24
However, it's really important that we are responsible for our own mental health. Sometimes this isn't healthy for me. I mute an account or I don't follow this, or I take a break. Recently, I took a couple of weeks off because the season started changing. I was dealing with some depression. I thought you know what I'm going to check out for a second. As an artist, it's hard to check off the social media, but I needed to. For a couple of weeks I did.
Speaker 3:
15:47
I think, being responsible for your own well-being, that's going to have a ripple effect in the way that you transact with other people Also, being honest, obviously we don't put all of our dirty laundry out for the whole world because it's not super safe. If I just take a selfie and I'm smiling and happy all the time and everything looks great, but then as soon as I put my phone down, I'm crying at home, dealing with something that's not super fair because it's giving a false image. I think the big thing is how can you be honest on a screen and in real life If you can do that in a loving way? That's encouraging to others. I think it's important and being really aware of everybody.
Speaker 3:
16:26
We don't always realize, but people are always watching. People are always watching. What you say matters. It's impacting others. Encourage people, speak life. Don't hold up a fake thing. That's not attainable, because all these people are using apps to change their bodies, their faces, their whatever Sure filters. They're fun, that's great, but at least try to be real in some capacity. That way, people don't feel like they can never meet this measure.
Speaker 1:
16:51
How about for the times when maybe we choose not to say something because we're just doing social, just to post about ourselves, but we're not actually responding to other people? Sometimes not saying anything just as bad.
Speaker 3:
17:03
I think it's super important to engage. I think you have to be honest, it's community, still it's still a form of community. I don't think. Obviously you can't always keep up with every comment every day, but I try because I love my people, people who are engaging with me. I want to engage with them.
Speaker 1:
17:20
Yeah, definitely. That's something that I've been trying to pay more attention to as well, especially on digital, because it's easy to get in the mindset. It's like, okay, I'm going to post things that's going on in my life, but then you have people that actually take time to respond and write something on your post, but then you just give them a like or something. I started asking myself, well, am I really showing them that I value? They took their time to write a comment on my post? How do I show them value back? I spend time writing to them, have communication. Communication should be a dialogue, not a monologue. That's what friends do. Friends talk to each other.
Speaker 1:
17:54
So I know our Q&A is going to be a little bit different. Usually, we'd bring a mic down so you guys could ask questions. So here's what we're going to do. If you want to raise your hand, me and Lydia are going to come down so we can hear you, and then we'll kind of repeat your questions so everybody can hear. So does anybody have a question that they would like to ask? Lydia?
Speaker 4:
18:12
So my question is kind of a twofer. I know that a big outlet for you is your music, because that's very evident in your music. So my first part of the question is where's your favorite place to write, where's your comfort zone to write?
Speaker 3:
18:28
A lot of times we'll just be in prayer and literally just what I'm feeling comes out. And so when it's me writing on my own, it's kind of it, it's just random, it's at home, it's in the car, it's wherever I'm feeling you know.
Speaker 4:
18:40
The other part of that is what is your. Do you have any other creative outlets other than music?
Speaker 3:
18:45
By journal, I blog. I've always thought about writing a book. I love to write. That would be awesome. It's huge, oh my gosh. I just love it.
Speaker 4:
18:54
I don't know, I'm scared.
Speaker 3:
18:57
I think it'd be fun, but also cooking. I love cooking Anything. I think most creatives are like anything that feels like you're all in, so like you're using your hands, you're using you know. I love things like that.
Speaker 2:
19:10
So, lydia, now that you've been down the road a little bit with counseling and all of that, if that same girl had come back to you now, how would you approach her? What would you say differently than you did when she first came to you?
Speaker 3:
19:30
So actually, if I'm remembering correctly, when I started going to counseling myself, I gave her a call and I told her hey, I was wrong.
Speaker 3:
19:39
And I'm, you know we're all on this journey. Yeah, for sure. I mean, there's Tim Keller is one of my favorite preachers and he's got a sermon titled A Still Small Voice where he talks about Elisha. When he was dealing with you know, he basically was like God kill me now, kind of thing, and he talks about how mental health can be spiritual, physical and medical. And I think that, listening to that sermon and working through a lot of things myself, realizing it's not a one size fits all, you know and realizing that God is a God of grace upon grace and like, if you don't know the heart of God, it's just that he loves us so much and he gives us so much freedom and so much mercy. If you're walking around on like eggshells, thinking God's going to be mad at you, that's not how he works and that's how I was, that's what I was operating in at the time.
Speaker 2:
20:26
Yeah, that's really great that you actually went and called her back. And also I feel like when you work through things, your mind is more clear to be able to talk about Jesus more with people, versus you know when you're in your kind of depressed mode or I have tremendous anxiety and all of that. So I feel like counseling is such a blessing that you know a lot of people are missing out on it's tough work. There's no lie about that, like for sure.
Speaker 1:
21:02
What are some outlets that you know of any outlets that people should be seeking out? Help it. Where should they go? What are some of your ideas, thoughts on how you send pastors, yeah.
Speaker 3:
21:11
I mean, obviously I don't think every church. I don't know how to phrase this exactly. I think we're still learning in the church right now how to talk about this subject. A lot of churches are doing it really well, but some of them aren't, and there's grace for that. Like I said, we're all in different places on our journey and God's reveals in his timing different things to each of us. But you know, for there are a lot of churches in Nashville where they have great counseling programs If you have a church like that that you can reach out to, then do it.
Speaker 3:
21:41
If not, there's something called NAMI. It's National Association of Mental Illness and it's nationwide and there's always local chapters wherever you live and there are groups that meet. There are all kinds of tools. It's really, really neat. There's just so many different options and tools for mental health. Obviously, you know, there's a new suicide helpline, I think it's 988. There's all these things. So the biggest thing is like there's no end of tools.
Speaker 3:
22:07
Just don't be afraid to ask, don't be afraid to be like hey. Like one of the sayings I think it's the mental health coalition they say fight in the open, stop fighting the battle in private. Just be willing to say, hey, I need some help. You know I post all the time. Hey guys, you know, a few weeks ago I was having a real hard mental health week. Hey, I'll pray for me.
Speaker 3:
22:25
This is a rough depression week, or even panic attacks. Like you know, I perform and it's laughable. I'm like God really Because I have such severe anxiety. Before I get on a stage I will get sick to my stomach, like I will almost have a panic attack, and I have learned little tools breathing tools, different things, or just even just saying All right, lord, here, you know, here it goes again. If I embarrass myself, I embarrass myself. I don't love doing this, but I know that I love what the outcome is. I know that you're using this and it's amazing. It's kind of like Moses. I feel like God asked Moses to do something. Moses was like you sure I have like a stutter problem or whatever. He's like. No, you're, you're the one who's going to do it. Like we're all kind of a mess and God likes to use messy people because if you didn't, nobody would be usable.
Speaker 3:
23:09
So I think, just being honest, just being honest, being open with safe people. You know we're all probably from different places, so I wish I could tell you my counselor's name, but most likely you're not here. So finding a local counselor it's not always a one size fits awesome. You have to shop around, find somebody who's the best fit for you. I've had to do that myself and now I'm with somebody who's fantastic and it's been such a blessing to me. But yeah, community church, eating healthy, talking to doctors, going to counselors all these things are important.
