Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of Couple of Nukes. As always, I'm your host, Mr. Whiskey, and I am here with Dr. Brian. We booked this about like three months ago, give or take.
I actually forgot about it. Until I looked at my calendar, I was like, oh, wow. I got an interview today. I better, uh, take care of that. I actually, I just got off of a TV show recording on suicide and mental health and I finished that and I was like, all right, quick walk the dog. And now I'm back at it. But I'm excited.
We are gonna be talking about Brazilian juujitsu. Yeah. Or so you would like, but, uh, we're actually gonna talk about addiction, but we will talk about some juujitsu for Dr. Brian. Here he is. A Brazilian Juujitsu fighter. He is a psychologist. He works with anxiety, mental health addiction, and it's been so long since he and I last spoke that his website has updated.
When I was first on it, there was a placeholder. There will be a book cover here, and now there's actually a book cover because. At the time of recording this in just a few days, his book will be out. Dr. Brian, tell us how excited you are about your book, who it's for, what it's about, and as well as a little bit about yourself.
Yeah, yeah. Well, thank you again for setting this up. It was a few months when we spoke and uh, I did also, um. Saw it on my calendar about a week ago and I said, oh man, that's coming up. I know we scheduled it and so I really appreciate, uh, having you, uh, having me come on anyway, I know we spoke on the phone and it sound like a great fit.
So yeah, I'm, I'm, to answer your question, I'm very excited. Uh, this book is about four years. Um, um, in the making. Wow. Um, I started writing it, um, actually during the pandemic in March, 2020, just like a spring day, uh, that we have right now. And as you remember, the, the, the, the onset of the pandemic, um, was a lot of uncertainty and, uh, I've been thinking about writing this book, uh, for some time has been few years prior to.
2020. And I just remember very clearly on a day like this, it's actually sunny here in Southern California. Right. And I was getting a lot of cancellations from appointments. It was just like people were just canceling left and right. And I was just sitting here like wondering like, what is going on?
When's this gonna end? And I was just staring out my window. I have some trees outta here and some other homes. And I just said, wow, let me open up my Word document. And I started typing. I just started typing. Wow. Um, six hours straight for about. Or more, uh, for, for every day for about six weeks. And so four years later it's here.
It's releasing, uh, May 1st, uh, which is next week. And I'm really, really excited. I've been already promoting it and marketing it and doing podcasts and, and so many, uh, different things. And I have a lot of things lined up for the next few months, so I'm really excited about it. And a beautiful book cover.
It is for those of y'all who are listening, not that we even have it on screen, but it is a key standing up. And the shadow of the key is a person who looks pretty down in the dumps and because it is about how to get your loved ones who are resisting, uh, you know, addiction recovery into that. And that's actually how Dr.
Brian and I connected because a lot of veterans and active duty military members get addiction issues. And it's already hard enough to get men to admit that they need help or could use help. Mm-hmm. Military men, you just put on a whole nother layer of, I don't need help, Mr. Macho man. And so I wanted Dr.
Bryan to come on here, one to talk about his book, which will be a great resource for all of y'all out there, but two, just what he's seen in the field of addiction and psychology and all of that. Again, you've been practicing for about 20 years now, correct? I. Yeah. Yeah. Let me, yeah, you asked me a little bit what I do.
So, yeah, let me give you, uh, what I currently do. I'm a licensed psychologist. I'm licensed in California. I see clients, I'm contracted with various, um. Entities and hospitals from all the way from San Diego to Northern California. I'm also in private practice and, um, see everyone through, uh, telehealth and I do have a specialization in insomnia.
Um, I use a cognitive behavioral treatment for insomnia. I. And then I worked a lot with substance use disorder and working at a residential treatment center for, uh, adult males and females struggling with significant substance use disorders or mental health conditions. And I also, um, um, been volunteering, facilitating a group, uh, through the national lines of mental illness, um, helping family members who are.
Struggling with a loved one who doesn't want to get help and they need education and strategies. And so, and then I enjoy exactly what we're doing today. I enjoy spreading mental health awareness. I give various talks at churches, uh, community center, support groups, podcasts, um, interviews here and there.
So that's really a big passion of buying is. Educating people on clarifying a lot of these misconceptions they have of mental health and letting them know that there's still stuff that they can do. You can still get your loved one back. We just gotta reformulate the strategies and, and, um, look at things a little bit differently.
And so, yeah. So it's a little bit about, uh, myself. And speaking of insomnia, that's right down the military lane there. I'll tell you that much. Yeah. But you know, speaking of, oh, sorry. Oh, go ahead. No, go ahead. Well, well, speaking of military too is, is for quite a while. I worked with, um, during my internships and postdoctoral internships, I worked with a lot of returning vets, uh, from, um, Iraq and Afghanistan and, um.
Helping them transition back to civilian life. And so, uh, and then in Brazilian jiujitsu, um, you get a lot of people who, uh, right, were former military or even even active military. And, uh, I've, I've spoken to quite a few people and they've been searching when they post military and their trail look for that same level of camaraderie and fellowship.
And they said Juujitsu is kind of very similarly resembles that type of this fellowship taking care of each other, but also that. That, um, grit and grind that you go through, right? Yeah. So, yeah, no, it's funny. My buddy, uh, my one good friend, we call him this slayer. He comes on the podcast quite a bit. He texted in a group chat the other day.
He's like, I, you know, me and a shipmate were skirmishing around and I got a, used the Americana on him. I'm so happy I, he goes to Brazilian jiujitsu practice every now and then. And so he was just bragging about that. So it's, it's funny that you say that. I was gonna say, you know, did you have any personal, uh, relationship or experience with any of this stuff such as addiction or mental health issues within your family or friend group that inspired this?
Or how did you end up, you know, in the field that you're in, I. Well, I think one of the things that I have found, especially in the work that I do in ERA 20 years, is every single family doesn't matter, has some type of Yep. Person or persons that's struggling. They may not talk about it, they may not have identified it, but there's, there's always that at least one person who struggles and, and people are just unsure what to do, whether it be a substances or maybe anxiety, depression, post-traumatic stress, whether they're not talking about traumas in their life.
So every family, and yes, I've had family members, um. Who've struggled on some level. And, and, and just talking about it alone, it destigmatizes it. And I know, um, the more people talk about it, the group effect of, Hey, gosh, I'm not alone. Or, Hey, I thought you had it all together and you struggle just like me.
And it really, really. Creates this permission for people to feel comfortable in, in talking about it. And uh, and I get people on the mats. Uh, one of my good friends, um, he, you know, he is a, he is a black belt and you know, you just look at him, he has all together and successful in his life. And, and he was open to me, uh, 'cause what I do, uh, in my, in my clinical work.
And he was telling me, man, I had, I had traumas. Repressed traumas growing up, and I had to go through treatment. That's why I was gone for a couple months. And so, uh, so you just never know, right? I always say to family members, you lift up the house, the roof, to any house, and there's things going on there.
Um, and I agree as, as well. And so. And that's what I try to do is, is help people say that it's okay to talk about it. Right. And it doesn't matter if you're, where you come from, what your background is and stuff like that. It's okay to, to, to talk about these things. It's, it's actually, to me, it's a lot more strength to be able to recognizing, being humble enough to admit that, Hey, I need some help and uh, I need to get better.
So, uh, but yeah. Right. Personal experiences and of course, um, you know. Working in this field, I believe it was not a straight field for me. You know, I wanted to go to law enforcement early on. I didn't, you know, I just wanted to do a lot of different things and I didn't, I stumbled upon this field in my zigzag journey, and I do believe this is what I'm supposed to be doing, and so I, I just believe there's a passion for me in it.
I think it's in line with my values and skill sets. So it was, it was a combination of things as you ask of, of right. Family experience and, and, and, and just my passion. Um, and I talk a little bit about my book, about that. Some of the journeys that I went through of staying in the fight is, is, is a really critical thing no matter what we do, searching for, um, a job career to navigating through sobriety, through navigating through traumas or PTSD, it's, it's, it's a, it's a fight.
It's a fight against this entity that wants to kind of keep us sick and Ill.
Right. You know, wow. There's, there's a lot to cover there. And one thing I wanna ask about. Your book is, you know, it, it's set up. It seems like it's set up as a, a guidebook for family members or friends who are trying to take care of their loved ones. Uh, you know, and these instructions and telling us kind of what we need to do is great, but is there reassurance there?
Because one of the most frustrating things I believe, is living with or taking care of an addict, especially like my father. Has been an addict. Both drugs are mainly alcohol for many years now. He was hospitalized with 20 times the lethal amount of alcohol. They said it's a miracle he is alive. He has sobered up and relapsed over 40 times in the past few years.
Sometimes it's a year and a half. Sometimes it's weeks, sometimes it's months. Typically it's just enough celebration to, uh, restock his alcohol supply. But we see a lot in families of addiction. Or anyone who suffers with addiction, uh, these cycles of trying to get better relapsing because it is a everyday battle.
And so it can be frustrating. Like for me, I know my frustrations are, you know, I'm, I'm happy and I'm proud he's sober and he relapses again. And sometimes the reasons, or there, there is no reason. He just does it and it's frustrating. I remember I had bought him a gift to commemorate his like year and a half mark.
Then he receives it and he starts drinking the next day, you know? And so, mm-hmm. Does your book help us with these frustrations with handling our mental health? Because it takes a toll helping other people. I'm sure you've, you have your ways of dealing with it. Just like I have my ways of dealing with the people I work with who struggle with their mental health.
It takes a toll on us. So is your book a resource for us as much as it is a guidebook for us to help others? Yes. And that's exactly that scenario that you just described is was the exact impetus or starting point why I wrote the book. So a little bit about the origin of the books is, as I told you that earlier, that I facilitate a support group and then I work in residential treatment and and so forth.
And what you find a lot is there's common questions and challenges that these families have. After a while, it's very, very thematic, meaning it's. Streamline. You know, you go into a group and their concerns are the same. They may be a little bit different here and there, maybe the condition their loved one's struggling with, but it's the same thing is that we're scared, we feel guilty, we don't know what to do.
You know, things like I. What if we set boundaries, we're afraid, um, he or she may on themselves, were afraid that they may run away and be trafficked on the street. We're afraid that they may never talk to us again. And so you hold, um, emotionally hostage. By the way, there was a psychiatrist, uh, who I took over and he was a former.
Um, special forces, um, for the military. He used to be a trauma surgeon and then he switched to psychiatry. And so, wow. A lot of the terminology he would use would be military. And, uh, so he would use the words emotional, uh, be held emotional hostage, and, which is true, you know, he called it, um Right. I love that.
That's so accurate. Yeah. And he called it the terrorist in the home. That's what he called it. And that's what the disease is, is so, if I can back up a little bit, disease, you know, we, there is no unifying. Definition in the medical arena of a disease in, in, in a lot of healthcare. Um, some people describe it as a pathological condition with symptoms.
Um, the World Health Organization defines it as, um, health without absence of infirmity. And I like to, and, and, and 12 separate recovery. Um, there's a definition that people call dis disease is not at ease. And to me, I like to look at it as any entity, right? Any entity in our life that's been long lasting and cause impairment.
Amen. And there's a lot of amen. Things that can cause that, you know, jealousy. You know, it's not, you can't find a medical definition, so to speak, or diagnosis or a psychiatric definition of. Jealousy, but it causes impairment in your life. If it can. So can greed. So can envy, pride. The seven dead sins, right?
So can materialism or so, or hedonism? Hedonism is this constant need for desire, for pleasure. So if those, so I believe we all have our own version of a disease and therefore we're all in some version of recovery and recovery. First thing we think about is, oh, what substance are you using or what injury recovering from.
To me, recovery is just any plan in place for better living. And so we're all have a version of a disease or diseases and we're all on some form of recovery. And it's, that's what I talk about, that our own recovery is the most important thing that we need to focus on because with we're not healthy and we're not in recovery, I.
None of the other things matter. We can't be a good parent, a good coworker, a good spouse, a good friend or athlete or what have you. And so, um, but yeah, that's where it came. The, the book came from these families that felt very stuck, very disempowered. And so what I, what I found through all working with these hundreds and hundreds of families are these very recurring traits or attributes and, um.
That's, that's, that's one of the things. So I came up with, oh, I believe the 25 must knows. I think these are 25 pieces of knowledge that are critical. And I'll talk a little bit about that to answer your question. And I believe anybody, if you're well versed in this brand new, it is the most foundational knowledge that you need.
And then I talk about things like the disease and how we have to shut that down. 'cause we find a lot of family members is your loved one's struggling. You say get them help. But what's critical is the family unit, if that family unit or that system doesn't change or grow with them, once they go back into that family unit, the probability of long-term success goes down, right?
If a family, and that's, it's an all hands deck approach, is that everyone, so I like to use a lot of analogies. Right. Um, either tug of war or, uh, I like to use a rowboat. You know, if you've ever rowboat and you're either racing or you wanna maximize your speed and distance, everyone's gotta be, of course, in cadence.
But everyone has to work a hundred percent on their share. Even one person slacks off. It affects everything. And so I use that analogy of a boat that, that immediate family unit, usually it's maybe a parent, spouse, uh, kids, adult kids, and so forth in that boat, let's say there's five people in a boat, I tell the family.
Including your struggling loved one, that you all have to assume 20% responsibility and you have to work a hundred percent on your 20%. 'cause everyone brings something to the table. And so, um, let me ask, so let me ask you if I may ask you this. Right. One, one of my 25 must knows. Um, so I. Any type of thing, right?
Any type of system wants to achieve a level of balance, right? Homeostasis, equilibrium. And so what takes us off balance is some form of stressor. Stressor can come in many forms. It could come in a relationship breakup, financial distress, medical condition, and there's healthy ways to bring balance.
Unfortunately, there's unhealthy ways to bring balance and usually substances. And I tell people all the time, like they, they come into treatment and they use a substance, right? Let's say they use marijuana, they use alcohol. And I say, gimme three words of why you use that substance. You know, do you wanna try, you know, just gimme three words, simple words of why they use that substance or they use that unhealthy coping mechanism.
Well, I would, if I only had three words, I would say to escape something. Okay, good. I feel like that's what I would say. That's true. That is very true. And yet, by the way, when I give this talk, no one has ever got it on the.like that. 'cause it's kind of a tricky question, but that's absolutely correct. Uh, but what I tell them is.
Because it works would be doing it if it didn't work for what it was originally intended to. But of course, as you use it more, you get more tolerant, it becomes dysfunctional, counterproductive. Right. If you drink alcohol to take the edge off, if you take drink alcohol to put you to sleep, yeah, it works.
But as you know, the more you out drink alcohol, the American tolerant and actually disrupt sleep. Mm-hmm. Right? And so, yeah, or even caffeine or anything like that. Okay. And let me ask you this. I don't know anything about your, uh, your, your father in that situation, right? But it's very, very, it parallels a lot of the families I work with.
So, three words of why your dad can continue to struggle and relapse and get a year under his belt and relapse and so forth. Gimme, you have three words of, of why he can, of why he, why he, why he keeps relapsing over and over again, keeps relapsing. I wanna say reset his liver. I know personally his goal is he believes that if he doesn't drink for some time, it stemmed from a book he read from an alcoholic, you know, uh, professor on alcoholism who was the case study.
My dad took it outta context. This study was, Hey, these college kids who used to binge drinking college yeah, stopped and their liver had completely reset. They weren't, you know, my dad, who's been drinking since he was, you know, 13, 14, and he drinks every day an entire bottle of vodka for, for breakfast and whatever.
He starts drinking at 5:00 AM and drinks all the way through. And so I just know his goal, his goal isn't to get sober. His goal is to just be able to have alcohol without being entirely crippled or, or dead, you know, 'cause he uses it. Originally to help with social anxiety and other issues, but he uses it now for everything to go to the movie theaters to go out town, to He has become completely reliant on it, and he's also drinking to kill himself.
I mean, if I really had to say the truth, I've studied him for many years. I've had a lot of conversations with him. At the end of the day, he believed that drinking himself to death is what we would call forgivable by God. 'cause he can't kill himself because he said that because of it. He tried having me kill him multiple times.
He gave me multiple different ways to do it, multiple instruments in my hand and tried having me take his life. His goal is to die and join his mother in heaven. 'cause he was obsessed with his mother who passed away. And so he believes alcohol is a tool to do that, that is not his fault. Uh, so it's very specific, unique example.
Um. It's just a waste of away. Mm-hmm. And, and obviously it sounds like you of course, would want him to stop and people around him, loved ones want him to stop. Right. And so the, back to the th three, um, three, uh, words is the reason why someone can keep, can you engage in these unhealthy patterns is because they can, right?
Is, is somehow in some form or fashion, there is some entities that could be. People, um, that cosign that that's okay to do that. And that's what I teach family members is how to set boundaries. And people think boundaries is this very cruel thing, but boundaries are, you know, people think that it's in your face and so forth.
Yeah. That's a form of setting a boundary and maybe in some situations that's necessary. Setting a boundary is being very clear of what I'm gonna participate and not participate in. And so what I find with people and, and I'm, I'm, I feel sad for your father is because what I'm hearing you say is he just has a lack of, of worth and meaning in his life, and it's not what I find.
And I, I also talk about. Different varying myths of suicidality. 'cause that's a reason why a lot of families stay stuck. They're, they're said, well, if, as long as my loved one is, they're drinking downstairs, but as long as they're not dead or as long as you know, or, or she's right, she's using Xanax and, and, and, and alcohol downstairs in her room.
But as long as she's not being assaulted on the streets, right, what's happening is they're just getting sicker and sicker. And the harder it is to get them. Better and help the longer they stay in that state of being. And so that's what I try to teach family members is, and your, your father and I've, I've had a lot of people come to treatment 48 hours before.
They try to make an attempt in their life. They literally want to die and so forth. But after they get healthier and, and, and better clear, they have a different mindset. He starts to have, they start to have self-worth and meaning. Maybe they might connect with a higher power, maybe they realize it's very hard.
For him to see clearly of, of what's out there around him when he is under the influence. And you start to realize like, wow, I matter. There's things I wanna accomplish in life. Wow. I have a son who cares about me. Um. Hey, or maybe, Hey, my mom doesn't want me to do this. She wants me to live my life, and so we gotta, right?
I tell family members is we gotta do whatever it takes to put them in that window of opportunity. That's what it really boils down to, is everybody getting on board to put their loved one in a point of desperation where they're gonna fight, flight, or freeze. To me, when you fight, you're gonna take it on.
When you freeze, you're paralyzed, you're more open direction. But sometimes they take flight, but everyone runs outta gas sooner or later. And you have to accept that, Hey, my loved one can die in this process or kill someone else, or right, or do something very, very, uh, with, with real huge consequences. But.
We have to accept that. And, um, I've seen, like I said, people who don't want to have the will to live anymore who, who, uh, have such low value in their life and they start to reestablish that once they start to get healthy and sober. So I'm hoping that's the case with your dad. It just means, it just feels like his, he's been so altered by his drinking, which is a depressant by the way, alcohol and that he feels like that's his only hope usually.
People are hopeless and helpless when they just want to end their life. And most people, they don't wanna die. They just want the pain to stop. And it sounds like your dad's in a lot of pain. Right. And I wanna address, uh, going back to the emotional hostage ness and boundaries. Mm-hmm. You know, it was interesting because my, my buddy this later who I mentioned before, he, he was talking to me about my whole situation and he said, Mr.
Whiskey, if it was any man other than your father. Who has done what he has done to your family through his drinking, you would've had him locked up or put into rehab. You wouldn't be so walking on eggshells around his feelings. And, and so I, you know, I have an emotion and hostage. 'cause I, I realized when he spoke that I was like, you know what, it's, you're right.
I said, and I recognize that bias. But it's hard to eliminate, you know, I think for any mm-hmm. Family or loved one. The last thing we want is to put someone we love in a hospital, a rehab program, especially when they don't want to go, when they're mm-hmm. Making it out to be this awful, horrible place and, you know, we don't wanna risk losing that relationship.
Yeah. And I was actually just speaking on, on the TV show was just on prior to this recording about emotional hostage in terms of when you have someone in the military trying to. Talking about taking their life or someone else's life. And I was talking about the situations I've been in. Do we report it or not?
Because in the military is a little different than the civilian world. Everything's reported, everything has consequences, right? Yeah. So, and, and the question I proposed was, I have a shipmate. I. And they're contemplating suicide, but they might just be talking, do I report them or not? Because if I report them and they end up getting separated or put in a hospital or it changes their whole career, they have to requalify stuff.
But if I don't and they take their life or someone else's life, then it's, it's bad. So I was talking about tough, that situation, which I've been in multiple times, and I, I wish you and I had recorded first so I could use the term emotional hostage. Uh, but I was saying, you know, I'm tied to them. As a military member, as a friend, not just a friend.
A friend who has worked with them and lives with them. You know, that military bond where we spend all our time together, we're forced to, and so with the addiction, it's almost the, the same way. So I, I completely get what you're saying. With setting boundaries, it's hardest for us to set boundaries with people we care about.
And so. What are, could you give us a few examples of these boundaries that, uh, people should be setting when they have an addict in a family? Yeah. Well, it's, it's, it's, you can, the thing is, is people don't realize a, a lot of families out there, for example, the terminology tough love comes from very, very well loving place.
It's what happens is a lot is you get a lot of families out there who interpret that as like tough luck. Like, hey. I don't want anything to do with you. I don't want anything to be, be a part of you and, um, until you get healthy. And of course, if you know of someone who's under the influence or, or, um, feel hopeless or helpless, you know, that that's, that's a direct correlation to just ending things.
And so you can still come from a loving place. Um, I call it assertive love. Where you can come from a very loving and empathic place, but there's also very firm boundaries. You know, I, I've, what I find is the healthiest relationships I find are, if you think of anyone, um, who you have a very healthy, uh, relationship with, I can almost guarantee you, you have a nice balance between having rules in, in the.
Uh, a relationship and you also have a relationship. Relationship is a level of closeness. And so, um, if you're too much rules and don't have any relationship with someone. If they're gonna rebel against you, like, who are you to tell me if you have too much relationship? You're too buddy, buddy, but there's no rules.
They're gonna say, um, um, you know, who are you to, uh, implement these things? So the best relationships that I find are where there's a nice balance between rules and relationship. And that could be with a coworker, that could be with a parent and child, that could be with a, a romantic partner, is you. You look at those people and there's, there's, there's.
Those boundaries also mean a level of trust and respect for one another. So, so some of the things, uh, for family members, I tell them is you can come from a loving place. And one of the things I tell them, one of the language that I use, I use different language, um, um, in, in my book is say, Hey, we care about you.
We're always gonna be here for you. We just can't continue to support this lifestyle that you're living. 'cause we are doing more harm than good. Like for your dad, it sounds like without knowing much about him, is he has options on the plate. You know, where, where's the motivation to get better? If he can still have people in his life, right.
Whether it be kids and so forth, and he can drink, it's sort of in his unhealthy mind. It's the best of both worlds. And what you do is you limit their options. Yeah. And when you limit their options, where I see some of the most powerful cases, it's a collection of people. Or situations that happen where you move them to a place where they have this aha moment, like, wow, I want to change.
I'm done with this lifestyle. But when they can keep plugging away, keep plugging away, and bounce from one place to the next, whether it be I. Couch surfing, whether it be one relationship to the next, one child to the next, you know, they're just lily padding. What we do is we're gonna shut that down. Shut down options, and to the point where they're in a point where they have to make a decision.
They're a point of desperation where, Hey, I don't wanna live like this anymore. But you also have to accept that some people, they, they may take their life. It's just what I found is many people as humans is we want to connect with people, want people in our life. And so that's where the family unit has to set those boundaries is tell them what they're willing to, um, support, not support, because we are doing more harm than good when we continue to communicate the idea that your lifestyle, we don't like it, but it's still okay.
You can still come around, be a part of the family and, and many, most people that I find they want that connectedness. Right. Every once in a while you get a rare person that, yeah, they're fine. They can live in the mountains by themselves. They can and stuff, but most people I find they want that connection.
Yeah, no, I know exactly what you mean because it got to the point with my father where I was like, look, I'm not gonna come see you unless you're sober. Which in the military, I rarely saw him anyway, and I know now my, my other sisters have moved away. My mom and him are living separate. She's been trying to get a divorce, but.
I was supposed to see him for my 21st birthday and he had been sober for quite a while and then he got super relapsed, really bad, one of the worst times, and I actually ended up canceling and it was awful. You know, I wanted to see my dad for my 21st birthday. I hadn't seen him in a long time. I had just gotten out of the military and I set that boundary and we have cut off all connection with him and said, look, my mom told him like, we will get back together when you're sober, when you.
You know, if you go to rehab or if you work with us, you know, and it, it was a, a process because originally they were, had ended up living separate and he could come see them on the weekends, my sisters and my mom. And the rule was, look, if you're gonna insist on drinking, you do it at your place, you're not gonna do it here around the kids.
And he was respecting that boundary. And then. That got compromised. And then, so my mom had to cut him off entirely. Mm-hmm. And what I found with my dad is it didn't matter who it was, because now he has these mistresses who do drugs with him. Who drink with him. Yeah. You know, and so he replaced us and I found that there's only two things he values in life, which is the alcohol and his mother who passed away, you know, because.
All his value was attached to his mother when she passed away. That was it. And, and he had just retired after 25 years of being a police officer. He had two homes that were paid off. One, one on a private island. You know, he had three kids who were successful. He had a loving wife who did everything for him, and he just attached all his value to his mother, who would've never wanted this for him.
You know, my grandma, she would hate to see the state he's in. She'd rather he live his life. I think that's what any parent would want for their kid. And so. You know, we did cut off all connections with him and he just made new ones. So, like you said, he still has options. Those options are other people, like you said, whatever entities.
Those are, those options are people who are enabling him and who knows what story he's telling them. He could say, you know, my, my wife left me and took the kids. She's awful, and now I'm drinking. They, they had no idea he's an alcoholic or a drug addict, you know, whoever these random people are that he's meeting.
Online or in person who are like, yeah, let's do drugs or drink together, you know? And I know even some of those mistresses that he's had, have cut off connections with him because his drinking was so bad. Uh, but he keeps just replacing them. Unfortunately, he has unlimited options because his value is the alcohol and a woman who has passed away.
And so it's not the people that he's cutting outta his life. Whereas for other families, like you're saying, it might be like, Hey, I don't wanna lose my family. You know, people who aren't drinking as much or their brain isn't altered as much, or they have more value in that. So I, I totally agree that it would be good if you set those boundaries and, and they realize like, I really am gonna lose everything.
It's just like a romantic relationship. When someone leaves or is gonna leave, you're like, wow, I really do need to fix whatever is going on because I don't wanna lose all of this. Yeah, and and I do believe that. It's never too late to make a change. I've seen people in their sixties finally get sober and stuff, and it, what I, what I say is, your dad still has his gas in his tank, right.
So to speak. And, and I think the family setting that boundary is huge. 'cause I do believe that people go through different stages of life of these realizations, these what we call existential moments. And, and Right. Your father may have one of those one day like, wow, what am I doing? And, and your family is doing the right thing is because what you're doing is.
When he ever has that moment of clarity, he's gonna say, re maybe, hopefully reassess his life. Like, what am I doing right? And um, he just, like I said, he just still has, um. Um, gas in, in that tank. And, uh, but when you shut down those options, um, um, some one day hopefully he'll have this realization, things will come a little bit more crystal clear.
And I've seen that happen a lot in treatment. They just on, they're doing benders and stuff like that. And finally when they hit another word is rock bottom is sometimes, um, people misconstrue that, is that, oh, you have to let them hit rock bottom. A lot of people don't know what rock bottom is. I like to.
Change the concept or reconfigure it or redefine it as, uh, hitting a point of desperation. 'cause when we know, when we're all desperate, we'll do almost anything. When we're desperate to eat, we'll eat almost anything. We're desperate for money. We'll do almost anything to get resources. And so that's what we're trying to do, point of desperation.
And for him. He might be in a point of desperation. There's that percentage where maybe he doesn't really want to die, and that's just part of that disease. The hope is right is, is maybe one day he'll have this realization that I have some worth. It just, it sounds like with your birthday, I, I can't say for sure, but it sounds like that was a self-sabotage.
I think there's so much that not you did everything right by recognizing that, but I think there was just. So much pressure to do that, that he probably didn't feel like he deserved it and just self-sabotaged it. Mm-hmm. Um, that's what it sounds like to me is, is, is that, is when people struggle with their own sense of value and meaning, you know, they, they don't want to get that promotion.
They don't feel like deserve it. They don't feel like they deserve these good things, and that's where the unhealthy thinking. Takes place and he probably felt like he's let you down all his life. Boom. That he didn't want that. He didn't want that pressure of being that right. And that's kind of where his sickness lies.
At least that's where my thought is. Mm-hmm. With that. Now one thing I wanna trust is we kind of mentioned groups and accountability. I know you know, my father, he makes fun of other people at AA and he always starts trouble there. And one of the things, one of the comments he made to me once was, you know, there's this old geezer there who's 70 and he's been sober for 20 years.
I don't know why he is still going. And I, and I, I told him, I said, dad, I have so much respect for that man because he knows his limits and, and the battle he's fighting inside and he's holding himself accountable. Mm-hmm. I said, all it takes is all it could take is a drop to go back. Yeah. All it could take is a day of not being held accountable.
And so I was wondering what your opinion. Is on AA groups and other support groups like that. Like a hundred percent. And for those listening who have, you know, family members or loved ones who are resisting those kinds of groups, what kind of encouragement can you give to kind of help them get there?
Good. Good. Great question. And so, uh, yes, I do believe in, in support groups, whatever, support groups in the 12 step groups and so forth, whether it be na, which is Narcotics Anonymous, um, AA, alcoholics Anonymous. There's Cocaines Anonymous. Marijuana is anonymous. I. Gambling's anonymous and so forth. And so, um, I really, really strong believer in that.
And what I tell people a lot 'cause I get people in early treatment, like, I don't want to go to aa, I don't need that and I don't want to hear newcomers share, or I don't wanna keep hearing the same story over again. I tell them, if I could summarize in one word why there's such thing as meetings. Why there's counseling, therapy sessions or what have you, or group therapy sessions.
I said one word. It's accountability. It's accountability, um, right, that you're, you're responsible to some entity. Yes. There's other good things that come along with it. There's fellowship, there's connection, there's all kinds of different things that come along with it. Mentorship, but accountability that, that you are accountable and.
Absolutely. I think, um, after treatment with definitely substance, um, I think, um, the, the, the 12 step arena and there's also, um, a lot of different support groups are critical because that's one of the most. Consistent factors is this fellowship around you that will hold you accountable. This disease loves to isolate and so when you isolate it's, it's gonna get you one-on-one.
Anything that you wanna take on, you have to respect its capabilities. And so that's where the mindset of a, of a fight comes on. And you think of any 'cause you're in the military as well is, you know, and I just had a tournament last week and, uh, when you disrespect the capabilities of what you're up against for me, an opponent for you, if you are, um.
A naval person you disrespect. The capabilities of the ocean. If you're right, a hiker, you disrespect the capabilities of the terrain. Or if you're a cave diver, you disrespect the capabilities of the caves. You, you know what can happen, right? Mm. And so we see that countless. And, and so we have to respect the capabilities.
That gentleman that you talk to, he's, um, 70 years old and 20 years sober, is he respects his capabilities of that disease. 'cause he knows it's. We say that it's the disease voice in the corner doing pushups, and it's not following you. It's just waiting. Game on. Um, one of my close colleagues who I used to facilitate groups in residential treatment, um, he's very open to talking about, um, his story that I mentioned in my book, but, um, he grew up in the eighties and cocaine and alcohol were his thing.
And, but he's been probably over 50 years sober. He is, um, you know, kid, grandkids and so forth and a lot, lot, lot, um, to live for. And he actually, um, um. Tried to do suicide by police, um, at, at a young age, adult age. And, uh, one thing he says, and it gives me goosebumps every time I say it because it really accentuates the idea of humility.
Humility is the, uh, well actually dictionary humility. Humility means the re re result of having been humiliated. Right? Mm. Your undefeated basketball team, you get your butt kicked by a small town team. You're pretty humbled, right? You're, you're humiliated, right? And so out of that comes humility, but also it means respecting the capabilities of what you're up against.
And he said, and he's like 50, almost 60 years sober. He said, if you put a line of cocaine in front of me right now, and he said, I can't guarantee you, I won't snort it. And it's like, wow. 60 years sober. He didn't say, oh man, I got this. There's no way. I won't even think about it. 'cause he knows if there's cocaine in front of him, he's already lost.
He lost 10 steps, 12 steps before. He's got checkmate way before that if there's a line of cocaine, right? And he says, yeah, he can't get into one story. And so that's, that always reminds me of how much respect, amen. Capabilities of what we're up against. Yep. And you know what the, the human ego plays a great part in the downfall of people because we've heard this all the time on social media and movies and books through our relationships.
You know, I can quit whenever I want. I can, you know, one store after how many ever years isn't gonna bother me. What I like that you're talking about, not underestimating your enemy, so to speak, what we talk about a lot in a lot, especially in, you know, the industrial industry when I was working. Nuclear side in the military.
And then when I worked at an acid producing plant in, um, when I got out of the military, complacency, we talk about the acid will always burn you. The reactor is always ready to kill someone, you know, and it's not, oh yeah, a malicious entity, but that's the truth, you know, you have to respect it. Even the ocean.
Anytime we would go swimming as kids, it was always like, respect the ocean because an undertow or a wave could come outta nowhere and take your life and. I understood that, you know, my dad didn't understand that with the, the man I mentioned going to aa. It's like, you know, you don't want to underestimate how much the, the human mind is powerful.
And even if he's being, if it, if he is anchored to this AA group, all it could take is one day not anchored and, and hill relapse. I've seen it happen, you know? Mm-hmm. There was people, my dad shared a story where someone in aa, I mean in her eighties. She ended up in the hospital because she relapsed after 20 something years and, and, and went wild.
Yeah. I mean, I like what you said in the corner doing pushups. I mean, it is waiting for us. It is waiting for us. Well, we think it's always following and all. I could define this disease. It's this separate entity, right? A lot of times people come into treatment recovery, support groups. Of course, we're talking about the traumas, the sadness, the anger, the guilt, but we forget about.
Those people prior to their disease. Right? Man, it's amazing what you hear, not who you are. They're passionate, they're loving, they're educated, they're successful, they're funny, they're empathic. It's just like this disease has infiltrated them, right? It's like 95% of. Their being, which they allowed to, and it's go gonna be 15% of their being that I say, it's never gonna be completely gone.
If you've struggled for a long time with alcoholism, anxiety, depression, PTSD, it's always there in the corner, but it's it gonna be taking up the whole room or is it gonna be like this little. 15% in the corner and managing its capabilities and understanding its its patterns and so forth. And it's kind of like this enemy that you have to realize and understand it.
And people have described their depression as this dark mist. Their anger is this red fire, alcoholism as this, this, this, this monster that's always. Calling it to come play and you just say, Hey, we respect its capabilities. And uh, and I learned that every day on the mats, man is 'cause you never know.
Brazilian juujitsu is one of those things in case your listeners aren't familiar real quickly. Right. Brazilian a juujitsu means gentle art. Believe it or not. It's a, it's, that's funny. I, it's kind of ironic, but it's a sort of a, it's a grappling submission of martial art where. It was designed for the smaller, weaker person to be able to defend and actually defeat a bigger person by using leverage and, and submission tactics.
And uh, and the thing is with jujitsu, you look at someone you can never know. You can have this person who's thin and skinny, but. They can, they can handle themselves. And so and so for me all the time, you have to always respect when I go compete is that you can never look at someone and say that person.
And you can have someone that looks great and built and they may not be great at Jiujitsu Juujitsu, right? So, but that's one of the things is you always respect, uh, what you're up against. And, uh, the fact that your dad's going to these AA meetings, there's something there, right? He's not going there just for fun or to make fun of people.
He just, yeah. Hasn't found the right connection. And hopefully one day he will. And, um, yeah, find that it doesn't, it, it doesn't help. Even sober, he's a very, uh, unbearable person too. It's like a, you know, it's not just the alcoholism sober him has always been, uh, narcissistic and aggressive, very aggressive person and it takes a very unique personality to get along with.
So you combine that with alcohol and the recovery and it's a, a mess. But what I was gonna say is. For all of my nerds out there. I don't even watch Harry Potter, but I know while Harry was fighting Voldemort its own entity, he also had a little piece of baby Voldemort in his head and they actually showed that in the movie.
He went in his mind and there was a little baby Voldemort crawling in there. So just from my nerds that give that little analogy out there. But I, I agree, but I think it's important not to define people by their diseases or their addictions. Mm-hmm. You know, like they are their own person and. Just as there will always be some part of, you know, the addiction in them.
There's always gonna be some part of them when the addiction is prominent, you know, and you just gotta breeze through to that. So, Dr. Brian, as we wind down here, what are, what are the big takeaways we should, you know, think about and focus on, or some perspectives we should reflect on that maybe? Is there anything you ever say that really shocks a, a family that they're like, we didn't even think of that.
Like, is there something that kind of blows everyone's mind? Well, those two, those two things, uh, because it works and because they can't, even with people who, right, use a substance is sometimes they don't even realize while they're using it yet, it feels good and so forth, is because it works. Right?
Because we don't like to talk about, because it works. 'cause we want to tell them everyone the opposite. Well, no, it's bad for you. Bad for you, bad for you, but it works. That's why someone uses heroin and not alcohol. Someone uses alcohol versus. Um, marijuana is, it works for what it was originally intended, but it becomes dysfunctional and because they can, people are like, like, yeah, that's such a simple concept because they can, I had this one client who was bipolar, psychotic.
He would smoke so much, drink and smoke so much marijuana. He would kick down his parents' door down at three in the morning and start yelling at them, and I asked them, Hey, how many doors does he kick down? He said About 15. Do you know why he can kick down 15 doors? Now. Why? Because he can. Right? 'cause he can.
And so I strategize them to a point where they set him up to a point of desperation. He got into treatment, got sober. And by the way, I just wanna tell you this too, this important concept. Um, I don't know your dad, right? But there's a difference between sober and dry, right? Mm-hmm. So dry just means I'm not using the substance.
I'm just white knuckling it. I'm not working on anything else. Someone who's sober means not only they absent from a substance, but they're working on their physical self, their emotional self, their social self self. Social self is like relationships, career and extracurricular activities. And then the spiritual self as the spiritual self is um, sometimes a higher power.
It's not a higher powers just, it can also mean, right. It can also be an addition to higher power or a deeper sense of purpose and meaning. And that's why I tell a lot of people, like a lot of people, it's more dry than sober. Yeah. There's more dry than sober as of right now, you know? Yeah. A lot of people resist aa, 'cause all get, they talk about God, their Bible, thumpers and so forth.
And what I tell people is, is, is, is if God doesn't work for you and so forth, just think of something greater than you, some greater process that could be mother nature, human nature, the ocean. Outer space, anything or even a better version of you. That's what happens a lot is people stay away from it, is because they deconstruct it and they, they say like, well, what does powerless means?
I'm not powerless and, or, I, I don't want, I don't wanna believe in God and so forth. And so just say, Hey, some entity that's caused you to feel powerless. And, and like I said, we all have our entity, I think 12 steps. Anyone in this world should. Work a 12 step because it tells you to understand that you have character defects you need to repair, be of service to others and all those things.
And I think 12 steps, it would be, would be here for years if it didn't really have some good concepts in it. But back to your question, the take homes, one thing I like to would like you to tell your, um, listeners out there is really have hope, right? The most sick people that I've seen them get better.
But it's, a lot of it starts with the family unit or the, the system that they're in, but treatment as long, it really, really does work and people can get better as long as, of course, the treatment is. Competent and so forth, but it's that family unit. The family does have power. They can retake their loved one back.
They could take over and not be more in, no more emotionally hostage. They can manage the terrorists in the home, but it all starts, I think, with that family unit. So that's one of the things we just gotta learn to shut down that. Manipulation, part of the disease, the anger, the blaming, the avoidance, the threatening, all that stuff is that manipulation part.
And that's also what I teach people is how to shut down what I believe that 20% of the disease, uh, is that manipulation part that prevents them from getting the help that they really need. Right. But that would be my biggest takeaway and, um, um, that I would like to share with your listeners and that I like to share with a lot of people when I give these talks.
Awesome. And you know, ladies and gentlemen, what, for those of you who are like, I have no one in my life who is an addict, or I'm not an addict, you know, here's another takeaway. Those three words, the be especially the, because we can and because it works, I. I want y'all to think about those of y'all who are in or know someone who's in a toxic relationship.
Mm-hmm. Same deal. Why do they keep going back? Because they can. Yeah. And does it work well? It work. Are they happy? No. But it's doing what they want. They're getting, whether it's sex or dates or whatever it is, maybe it's financial stability. Same thing. So those, those three words aren't just for addiction, you know?
It's for a lot of, yes. The battles we struggle with. And so I wanna say that, and then Dr. Brian, before we have you leave here, we'd love for you to grace us with some of your tales of Brazilian juujitsu. Have you competed in big competitions? Like what's your. I know you're busy as a doctor Of course. So how much free time do you really have for Juujitsu, and if so, do you compete across the country or are you just a I do California crusader, or I do.
I do. I actually had an Orange County open here, um, in full California. Okay. And then I'm actually, um, flying out to San Jose, California, Northern California next weekend. Nice. The real big one is what we call the master worlds in Vegas. It's one of the biggest wow world tournaments for, uh, for people. And so, um, yeah, I'm, I'm pretty, uh, fanatical when it comes to Juujitsu because I believe, uh, the best health I've ever been and the best mental stability I've ever been has been since training.
I trained martial arts, um, and competed as, as a kid growing up and I played competitive sports and this was just one of those things I needed to do. But it is a. Life and game changer. And I know people say that, and it's you, you won't know it until you really experience it. Right. And it's, it's addicting.
It is. And that's why you see a lot of people in recovery transition to jiujitsu is because it's one of those martial arts where, yeah, you can get hurt, but it's not like a striking martial art where you're, which is Right. Which is good too. But you're, you're not, you, you can't, the thing is, with jitsu, you can spar hard every single time.
And, and like I said, this is the best shape I've been in, the strongest I've ever been in. And, but I do love to compete. Um, um, I, yes, I've traveled, uh, not outside the US yet, but I want to, they have big tournaments in Brazil. Okay. And Europe and Paris. But uh, but I definitely travel around the United States for tournaments and so it's a real big passion of mine.
Alright. Are you like the highest rank, I guess they have their own ranking system. I'm not familiar with it. Yeah, well, divided by your age, weight, and your belt. I'm a current Okay. Uh, purple belt. Um, I've been, um, trained for six years. Okay. So after purple is a brown and black and so usually it takes about 10 years, um, or more to, uh, receive your black belt in Juujitsu.
Oh, well you're more than halfway there, so you're, uh, yeah. It's one of my goals almost there. Alright, that's, that's gonna be awesome. We look forward to that. Well, ladies and gentlemen, you can find Dr. Brian's website and his book. Keyword his book in the description below. So be sure to check that out. And, you know, even if it's not you, if I'm sure there's someone you know who might need this, uh, either this podcast episode or the book, and again, his website because Dr.
You are available for, uh, personal counseling, uh, right. People can book you or hire you to, um, work with them personally. Is that correct? What I, um, do mostly with on the private practice level is a family, um, intervention, not the family intervention where you get the loved one and sit 'em in a room, right.
It's more of the upfront where you get the family members to get on the same page, create a unified vision, right. And come up with a strategy to get them help. And so that's the level of the work that I do in terms of, uh, call, I call it family crisis intervention. Okay. And, um, and so that's, that's the capacity I do on my, um, private practice, uh, work.
Okay, perfect. Yeah, I just wanted to make sure I put that out there. But, um, you hire him, he's not gonna come there and use his juujitsu on your addict in the home. He's not, you know, he is not that kind of intervention, so no, he's gonna come there and speak some wisdom and so, yeah, I just wanna put that out there.
His website, his book, and himself all available in the description below. Dr. Brian, thank you so much for coming on the show. It's been a great time. Thank you so much. It's been a pleasure
